kerdi membrane over cement board kerdi membrane over cement board

We use a pump action garden sprayer and its usually dry by the time we clean the sprayer. 120 sq feet including the floor. We waterproof the outside the hardiboard in 99% of the install with something like redgard. As such, many homeowners and professionals find themselves wondering whether Kerdi Board or cement board is the better tile substrate. . Its essential to protect surrounding wall and floor surfaces from water or moisture damage that can occur in these areas. He would take his rough opening measurement and subtract the thicknesses of the tile, the cement board, and in his unique install method the purpleboard. This flexible polyethylene layer is easy to install and can protect the tile from both cracking and moisture. To properly seal a cement board for a shower, its important to first properly prepare the surface. When cleaning thinset off of Schluter membranes, the manufacturer recommends using a wet sponge and taking care to avoid any scoring or inconsistencies on the surface of the membrane. Furthermore, if you're working in an older home KERDI-BOARD fits better than cement board in odd spaces. True cement board (Durck, Wonderboard) is my first choice as a tile or Kerdi backer. Schluter Kerdi-Shower-T/-TS/-TT 48 in. The Schlter system tends to be more durable than a cement board, but it also depends on the particular application and the weather. . Will be doing a bathroom gut and will be laying durock cement board over plywood sub floor. This is necessary to ensure that the membrane will adhere properly to the drywall. Go with smaller bags or only mix half. This thread is 9 years old and it's the Hardi board that's thirsty not the Kerdi. I have used kerdi, and I have applied it over cement board. When doing so, it is important to ensure that the drywall surface is clean and free of dust, grease, and loose paint. Since the existing wall board will be removed, I'd prefer to go a little extra and install a water proof cement board type base so the tile has a solid substrate even if it were to get wet, such as from a plumbing leak, or from infiltration on an exterior wall (as unlikely as that might be). To subscribe to this RSS feed, copy and paste this URL into your RSS reader. Thanks to all for the feedback. Thanks. But a mortar bed does have advantages. Ditra is manufactured in a 3'3 width and comes in various roll lengths (54sf, 150sf, and 323 sf). When installed, Kerdi Board creates a substrate that is level, flat, square, plumb, and dimensionally stable. In my. It only takes a minute to sign up. Dean, our tile consultant, says glass mat backer board is his first choice due to the ease of installation, cost, and because his workers like it. Cement board is typically used in wet areas, such as bathrooms and areas with a lot of moisture, because it is waterproof and provides a level of protection from water damage and long-term moisture exposure. Glass mat gypsum board is a better choice. You are wise to use a cement board. if you go with vapour barrier, then cement board. I trust it and have never had a callback. I also used the Kerdi drain. It doesn't matter but you absolutely need to use both a substrate and a waterproofing membrane. After installing your mud bed, make sure it is fully cured before applying Aquadefense. Kerdi Board panels have a number of other advantages: they can be cut to size using an ordinary utility knife, can be glued or screwed into place, and are very lightweight. Depending on factors such as room temperature, humidity, and ventilation in the area, this could take anywhere from 1 to 3 days. is the contractor creating a waterproof schluter-kerdi shower? Step 7: Cut the Tile. Fixing that is not that easy though. Modified thinset adhesive is a premixed product that contains latex or acrylic components which make it quite a bit more flexible than regular thinset adhesive and therefore better suited to some applications. What precautions should I take installing tile on a backerboard in an area surrounded by cement? Once its cleaned, use caulk to seal all of the seams where the cement board meets the walls. This will help you achieve the best results and ensure the longevity of your project. Cement board is readily available and relatively inexpensive (about $10 for a 3 x 5-ft. sheet). Answer (1 of 3): Schluter recommends applying Kerdi over drywall for walls, however, my local building code will not permit this practice - the local building code requires cement backer on the walls of a shower enclosure, therefore, I have done this successfully many times. Plus, if you use the mold and moisture resistant drywall, it will be extra insurance against mold. Can I install Kerdi board just on the walls of my shower and use a PVC membrane on the floor? What do you mean it doesn't adhere? We store towels, medicine, toiletry supplies, first-aid gear, massage devices, facial steamers, spare Painting your garage is a great way to improve the look of the space and make the walls easier to clean. They are designed to provide a waterproof, vapor-tight layer to the substrate, which in this case would be the cement board. I also used the Kerdi drain. After priming, use an approved adhesive to adhere the KERDI membrane to the drywall, making sure the edges are well sealed and joints are tight.if(typeof ez_ad_units!='undefined'){ez_ad_units.push([[468,60],'remodelormove_com-medrectangle-4','ezslot_12',156,'0','0'])};__ez_fad_position('div-gpt-ad-remodelormove_com-medrectangle-4-0'); A successful installation of KERDI requires well-prepared surfaces and a proper application, so take the time to properly prime the drywall before installation. It is a topical waterproofing layer that is put over the substrate to keep water from getting to the wood frame and nails. On top of that, fiber cement board is even more brittle than standard cement board, so you have to be extra careful to keep screws at least an inch from the edge to avoid breaking the board. In the worst case, it's OK to cut the Kerdi, remove the damaged section, scrape up the thinset from the areas, and set a new piece of Kerdi. Politique d'Utilisation des Cookies de Houzz. Cement board is the most common and widely-known backer board. Hardie board is thirsty, but that's way too fast. How should I transition between cement board floor and alcove tub? It is a fast process that is hard to mess up if you do it right. They are absorbed into the surface material and help keep moisture away from the substrate surface. Retired Moderator - Theatre Guy (and computers). Your real issues are the lack of proper corners on this shower. Your email address will not be published. I think I'll try using the thinned mixture of Redgard and then try the Kerdi membrane again. I set the Kerdi with my hands, pat it into the thinset with my hands, then go over it with a 4" taping knife held at a low angle to embed the Kerdi in the thinset. To waterproof Hardie board, you should choose a quality sealer that is designed for use on cement-based sidings. Once the wall is prepped, use a primer that is compatible with the KERDI membrane so that it will properly adhere to the wall. Additionally, the drywall should be primed with a latex primer before applying the Kerdi membrane. If he did the framing for the shower, then in order to measure for it correctly, he would need to know how thick the tile is so that he can avoid exactly this problem. We think it is the cement board (Durock) sucking the moisture out of the unmodified thinset. Following the instructions for the product being used and ensuring that all of the necessary steps are followed will help to ensure a successful installation. I think the first one I used was cheap and that was part of the problem. A place where magic is studied and practiced? The cement board needs to be clean, free of debris, and dry. So long as the seams and joint areas are properly prepared, the panels can also provide waterproofing. Start by cleaning the cement board with a mineral oil soap; this will help reduce mold and mildew growth throughout the life of the shower. Kerdi can be installed first on drywall or cement board. I used this to seal a 3 1/2 by 6 1/2 foot shower with 7 foot walls. This is confusing since Kerdi Board has no Kerdi on it. The Kerdi membrane should be applied with the standard procedure, using a hogg brush or a notched trowel to spread the thin-set mortar and a roller to ensure appropriate adhesion. When installing KERDI with . The gridlines printed on the surface are beneficial for the installation process, also allowing for quick, neat cuts with a utility knife. When it comes to installation, a Schlter system is typically easier to install than a cement board, and it also allows for more design freedom as it does not require a traditional waterproof layer. These multifunctional tile substrate and building panels are thus perfect for creating bonded waterproofing assemblies with tile coverings. Redgard is a similar product. You are telling someone "to have" an artistry that not only takes art skills, knowing how to mix mortar for different situations, and a good amount of practice. We want that inside corner able to move. Thanks Paul! #3 This is a DIY site. If a law is new but its interpretation is vague, can the courts directly ask the drafters the intent and official interpretation of their law? Required fields are marked *. We were using a 3/16 x 5/32 trowel, probably to small. Installation instructions vary depending on the type of Kerdi membrane being used, but typically the membrane is applied directly to a clean, dry plywood surface that is free from dust, dirt, and other debris. I just a few weeks ago put kerdi on top of hardi-board in my shower and it was PAINFUL! That would tell him where the edge of the framing needs to be. Jessica considers herself a home improvement and design enthusiast. RedGard, on the other hand, is a liquid waterproofing membrane made by Custom Building Products. Here's how to get it right the first time, If you've got a steady hand, a few easy-to-find supplies and patience, you can install a tile backsplash in a kitchen or bathroom, Step 4 in swapping your tub for a sleek new shower: Pick your waterproofing materials and drain, and don't forget to test, Work with your contractors and installers to ensure a safe, stylish curb that keeps the water where it belongs, Get the benefits of a time-honored ritual without firing up the coals, thanks to easier-than-ever home steam systems, Landscape Architects & Landscape Designers, Outdoor Lighting & Audio/Visual Specialists, Out With the Old Tile: 8 Steps to Prep for Demolition, Convert Your Tub Space Into a Shower Waterproofing and Drainage, Steam Showers Bring a Beloved Spa Feature Home. rev2023.3.3.43278. When applying the thin-set, it should be applied in such a way that it fully fills any empty space between the Tile and Schluter product and is solid enough to support the weight of the tiles being installed. Then you can apply a thin layer of KERDI-FIX to the board, the membrane over top, and use a rolling pin to press it down and ensure a secure bond. On the 'rolling pin', it actually wasn't the kitchen kind, but rather a very heavy metal roller DH had from some sort of fabrication table. You just need a hammer and wonderbar for the walls. Can be cut to size easily using a utility knife. Or will the Kerdi membrane (with seams taped with kerdi band) prevent each board from moving independently? When it comes to tile underlayment, your options can be categorized into three main classifications, each suitable for different tiling circumstances: Although cement board is the most commonly used underlayment for tile, Kerdi board is growing in popularity as a multifunctional tile substrate. That means that you do not have to rely on a surface membrane or worry about the board failing if the core is exposed to water. Both Kerdi Board and cement board are designed to smooth out uneven spots on the installation surface, create an unbending layer that wont flex underfoot, and also provide a waterproof barrier. Rolling pin, good, now I can throw away my magnesium float.LOLCasey. It is also widely available and a relatively inexpensive option approximately $10 for a 3-foot by 5-foot sheet. Ceramic Tile Advice Forums - John Bridge Ceramic Tile, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G4HjHT6_cUo, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wEt6irjJCI0, My master suite addition & full bath to 1/2 bath renovation. Kerdi board, on the other hand, is an extruded polystyrene foam panel. 120 sq feet including the floor. But there are downsides. We are no longer supporting IE (Internet Explorer) as we strive to provide site experiences for browsers that support new web standards and security practices. It is designed to form a waterproof layer between cement board and tiles, helping create a watertight installation. Kerdi Membrane is a product of Schluter systems. The waterproof membrane isn't a substitute for the substrate. Well, I'm going to give you three different ways to seal the backer board at the tub flange. The main types of cement board you could encounter are Fibre Reinforced Cement (FRC) board and gypsum board. Kerdi Board is expensive, but I can justify it because it saves time, and it's a joy to use. Will use the Schluter Shower system. Cement board sucks up the moisture and as a result, the kerdi doesn't always stick as well to cement board. Waterproof showers are the trend today, so RedGard is an excellent alternative to cement boards that act as vapor barriers. Hardie board is a cement-based siding product that is water-resistant, but not waterproof. Waterproofing cement board is relatively simple and there are several different waterproofing products available. Everyone knows brick and stucco, but what about fiber cement and metal? This will ensure that the coating sticks to the cement board. Do you have any pictures? The taping knife at a low angle makes an enormous difference, and I'm very grateful for that hint. The back side of the drywall fails and it is just as bad or worse than if it had an issue on the tile side. Whether youre installing tile on a floor, wall, or countertop, choosing the right type of substrate, or underlayment, is critical to preventing breaks and cracks in both the tile and the grout. What Is the Difference Between 'Man' And 'Son of Man' in Num 23:19? If installing large format tiles (over 15"), be sure to give the Aquadefense at least 8 hours to cure first. This is the traditional tile backer. The colour is different. First, it's super lightweight compared with the rest. Slap it up comb it out, leave every ridge tall and perfect. I would fear leaks in all corners of this shower. (3ft-3in wide)Or will the Kerdi membrane (with seams taped with kerdi band) prevent each board from moving . You peeled it off? Depending on your project and the specific cement board you are using, you will want to select a thinset appropriate for both.if(typeof ez_ad_units!='undefined'){ez_ad_units.push([[468,60],'remodelormove_com-large-leaderboard-2','ezslot_15',158,'0','0'])};__ez_fad_position('div-gpt-ad-remodelormove_com-large-leaderboard-2-0'); The two primary criteria to help guide your selection are the type of cement board you are using and whether you are installing it indoors or outdoors. Why is there a voltage on my HDMI and coaxial cables? I agree that gypsum seems very questionable anywhere in the wet areas of a shower. if(typeof ez_ad_units!='undefined'){ez_ad_units.push([[580,400],'remodelormove_com-large-mobile-banner-1','ezslot_17',164,'0','0'])};__ez_fad_position('div-gpt-ad-remodelormove_com-large-mobile-banner-1-0');As an added precaution, you may want to consider to adding a water-resistant layer afterwards, such as a caulking or flashing tape. It is important to waterproof Hardie board to make it more water-resistant, as well as to protect the materials from the elements. This makes Kerdi Board suitable for a wide variety of interior applications, including kitchen countertops. But I can't give you a +1 because telling someone to mortar all the walls in a large shower is like telling them to make an ice sculpture. Yes, it is recommended to waterproof cement board, especially if it is going to be used in exterior settings or in places where it will be in contact with water. if(typeof ez_ad_units!='undefined'){ez_ad_units.push([[250,250],'remodelormove_com-narrow-sky-1','ezslot_27',168,'0','0'])};__ez_fad_position('div-gpt-ad-remodelormove_com-narrow-sky-1-0');if(typeof ez_ad_units!='undefined'){ez_ad_units.push([[250,250],'remodelormove_com-narrow-sky-1','ezslot_28',168,'0','1'])};__ez_fad_position('div-gpt-ad-remodelormove_com-narrow-sky-1-0_1');.narrow-sky-1-multi-168{border:none!important;display:block!important;float:none!important;line-height:0;margin-bottom:15px!important;margin-left:auto!important;margin-right:auto!important;margin-top:15px!important;max-width:100%!important;min-height:250px;min-width:250px;padding:0;text-align:center!important}Waterproofing should also be done on other areas in the shower as well such as the corners, window sills and other areas where water can easily accumulate. It is a pliable waterproofing membrane that also doubles as a vapor retarder. Kerdi Board as a whole is much easier to install than Cement Board. All it takes is the right preparation. To install Kerdi Membrane, start by applying Schulter ALL-SET mortar (or similar) to your cement board substrate using a 1/4" x 3/16" V-Notch Trowel. Once the adhesive has been applied and has had time to properly cure, then the KERDI membrane can be applied to the wall. Will be replacing tub shower combination with tiled shower in my home. The curb doesn't have to be any wider than a 2x4. If you choose to use Aquadefense as a shower pan liner, be sure to continue it up the walls at least 6", tying into your waterproofing on the walls. If you ensure that silicone goes in and that the thin-set and grout do not bind there you should be good to go. Will add it in. A 1/2-inch thick, 3 x 5 foot sheet weighs just 7-1/2 pounds, compared with 45 pounds for a similar size sheet of cement board. The grid lines on the surface are incredibly helpful for installation and making neat cuts. Putting this stuff on walls is difficult and time . I don't want to use the Ditra membrane product but rather tiles directly over the cement boards. It fell right off? If you do not already have the hardi up, I recommend using real cement board (Hardi is a fiber-cement) or drywall. Is it suspicious or odd to stand by the gate of a GA airport watching the planes? There is definitely skill & planning required to doit right. Cut the Kerdi membrane to size using a utility knife or scissors. This will help to extend its lifespan and make sure it looks its best for years to come. And by 'booking the Kerdi' I mean we put it in the bathtub, sprayed it with the handshower, then booked it (just like wallpaper). It also helped me to work in smaller sheets. En cliquant sur Accepter , j'accepte l'utilisation des cookies telle qu'elle est dcrite plus en dtail dans la Politique d'Utilisation des Cookies de Houzz. Various products can be used to waterproof shower walls such as water-resistant drywall and cement backer boards. However, you do still have to take care to waterproof the seams and the fastener penetrations to create a waterproof assembly. #2. MAPEI makes products for each step of the remodel process, giving you a single source solution, and only one phone number to call if you need assistance! KERDI was developed as a waterproofing membrane to be used in . You troweled on thinset combing it out then pressed the Kerdi into place? Browse other questions tagged, Start here for a quick overview of the site, Detailed answers to any questions you might have, Discuss the workings and policies of this site. The Kerdi is essentially replacing the backerboard. To line niche shelves, for instance. there should be a small gap between the backer board and the tub. Such membranes typically come in a brush or a roller form and can help create a durable barrier against water infiltration. Welcome to the site. When applying the primer, make sure to cover all surfaces thoroughly, as these will be completely covered by the KERDI membrane. After roughly two days I would fill the corner with silicone. My understanding is that Schluter-Kerdi, being a sheet topical membrane, recommends just going with regular drywall instead of cement board but you can certainly use cement board as the substrate. About an argument in Famine, Affluence and Morality, Acidity of alcohols and basicity of amines. How can I find out which sectors are used by files on NTFS?